Summary: A recent discussion between Jonathan Karl and Katie Couric paints a chilly picture of the relationship between Joe Biden and Barack Obama, with claims of missed meetings, lingering resentment over 2024 campaign decisions, and family anger centered on how Biden’s exit unfolded.
Reports from ABC News correspondent Jonathan Karl, speaking on Katie Couric’s podcast, suggest the personal bond between Barack Obama and Joe Biden has frayed. Karl described an awkward encounter in Washington where the two former presidents were in the same restaurant but did not cross paths. That scene is being taken as a symbol of a wider strain between them.
Karl offered blunt assessments: when Couric asked, “What’s their relationship like?” his reply was stark. “Really bad. Really bad,” Karl said, and he attributed a lot of the heat to how the 2024 campaign ended. People in Biden’s orbit reportedly blame Obama for pushing him toward exiting the race.
Karl also relayed personal anger from Hunter Biden, who appears to hold Obama responsible for moves that accelerated pressure on his father. Hunter told Karl he was furious about an onstage moment when Obama led Biden off a stage after a fundraiser, saying, “You don’t grab the President of the United States like that.” That episode is framed as more than a faux pas—it’s a flashpoint.
The conversation included an anecdote about Cafe Milano in Washington, DC, where both men were present but did not meet. Karl noted that people close to Biden believed he could still win the 2024 election despite the infamous debate where his cognitive decline was widely noted. Even so, the campaign’s final days left a lot of wounded feelings and questions about loyalty.
Karl recounted the decision-making around Biden’s withdrawal. “By the way, when he finally made that decision, he calls Kamala Harris and says he’s dropping out,” Karl explained. “Kamala Harris really pushes him to make the endorsement immediately, which he ultimately does.” The portrayal put emphasis on the internal dynamics and who was in the inner circle when that exit happened.
That narrative also included the detail that Biden did not take a call from Obama after announcing his decision, even though Obama had apparently called. Karl said the two did not speak for weeks and only reconnected right before the convention. The silence between them surprised many who expect former presidents to coordinate closely.
There’s been a lot of talk on how Kamala Harris sat down and made over 100 phone calls to get people to support her campaign and to get started. But Biden made a whole bunch of phone calls that night, too. I was astounded to hear that one person he did not call was Barack Obama, the person that really made it possible for him to be President by making him vice President. Obama did call, I learned, to talk to Biden. He didn’t take the call, and the two of them did not speak for weeks. They eventually spoke right before the convention. But can you imagine? I mean, literally not taking the call.
Karl said Biden and his allies felt pushed out by various forces, including public calls for him to step aside. He singled out the George Clooney op-ed as a notable turning point that the Biden family took personally, believing it helped build momentum for pressure to drop out. That sense of betrayal appears to fuel much of the resentment.
The brouhaha didn’t begin in 2024, according to the timeline Karl sketched out. Tensions, he suggested, have roots going back to 2016 when Obama discouraged Biden from entering the presidential primary, warning it would be tough against Hillary Clinton. Biden reportedly interpreted Obama’s caution and a delayed endorsement in 2020 as signs Obama’s confidence in him was limited.
Those long-simmering grievances now look amplified by the very public failures many Republicans and conservative voters point to. From this perspective, Biden’s mishandled moments and his team’s finger-pointing make clear there was a collapse of the kind of unity that once defined their partnership. The result is not just personal coldness but a political problem for a party that needs a cohesive message.
Karl also related that family dynamics intensified the split. Hunter’s anger, as described to Karl, isn’t only private frustration — it’s a public narrative being used to explain why Biden’s inner circle reacted the way it did when calls for him to step aside grew louder. That ongoing grudge shapes how former allies and advisers are now described in political conversations.
Whether this rift will be repaired remains unclear, but the story underscores how bruising modern campaigns can be, especially when old alliances are tested by new crises. The account Karl shared paints a picture of strategic missteps, hurt pride, and leaders who may not be on the same page anymore.
